User talk:Justme/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Archive 2

~~Waiting for templates. Justme (talk) 21:58, 14 November 2022 (UTC)~~ Y

Search for all pages with "Wikipedia"

https://test.justapedia.org/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=100&offset=0&profile=all&search=Wikipedia

Search did not find Module:Protection banner/config. There may be some other modules that justa need a similar edit. — Just an editor (talk) 02:17, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

I got all the "Wikipedias" and you can do the "Wikimedias" (Foundation) if you like. — Just an editor (talk) 02:38, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Just an editor - what did you do when you got all the "Wikipedias"? — Justme (talk) 00:01, 28 December 2022 (UTC)

I made a couple edits. – — Just an editor (talk) 15:45, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Just an editor – if you have MSWord, copy the Justapedia page in edit vew, open a blank Word doc, and paste it. In edit mode, do a FIND - REPLACE search for Wikipedia and add Justapedia as the replacement and click replace ALL. Do the same for WP to JP, and Wikimedia to Justapedia. When done, copy the full page, select all of the Justapedia page and paste the MS doc as the new Justapedia page. You can do that for all the namespace pages, templates, notes/notices, etc. - at least for those we intend to keep, or the ones you are working on. — Justme (talk) 16:14, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Separate rating class for article's overall reliability.

Regarding this, Justapedia should keep all the articles as it strives to be a "compendium of knowledge" and away from deletionism obsession that plagued Wikipedia a lot, and as a balance a separate article rating class for reliability should be introduced.

Though unsourced articles made organically on Justapedia should be deleted, I think that those that are unsourced from the time of import should be grandfathered. — Ron Merkle (talk) 02:48, 30 December 2022 (UTC)

I agree, Ron Merkle, and I've stated similar on both WP and JP. I have a plan to use those stubs and articles needing improvement, and can utilize them in a productive manner in our (a) Fixathon competitions, (b) training new editors, and (c) for working with universities who want to teach their students how to edit Justapedia. They can be held in draft space because text doesn't take up much storage space. — Justme (talk) 16:48, 30 December 2022 (UTC)

Given Wikipedia's well-known systemic bias Justapedia should ride on the Avatar craze and ~~market~~ present itself as a friendlier repository of knowledge about cultures and histories of indigenous tribes across the world. — Ron Merkle (talk) 17:13, 30 December 2022 (UTC)

Ron Merkle, would you be so kind as to read Justapedia, JP:Policies and guidelines, and check the links there, and in the JP:Policies and JP:Guidelines templates to make sure we have properly updated the names and that they apply to our mission? — Justme (talk) 21:34, 30 December 2022 (UTC)

Will do. — Ron Merkle (talk) 21:51, 30 December 2022 (UTC)

Seems fine at a glance. — Ron Merkle (talk) 21:53, 30 December 2022 (UTC)

Space backup mission

Happy New Year! First order of business should be setting up a dump site similar to dumps.wikimedia.org at Wikipedia. The nearest window I can find in launching the backups goes to ispace (Japanese company), which has planned many more Hakuto lander missions throughout this decade. As for making the discs, perhaps Nova Spivack of Arch Mission is a good entry point for contact. — Ron Merkle (talk) 18:27, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Happy New Year, and back atcha!! I speak Texican, a little Papiamento, I can cuss in Italian, and I know a little Dutch (not a person but the language), and what you just posted is closer to Martian – a language I cannot speak. Paradigm, do you understand what Merkle is proposing, or asking for in a dump site? Merkle, do you need it to flush or can it be outhouse style? Paradigm, it is possible that I have it all wrong, and that he is talking about making contact with outer space. He mentioned a space backup mission. 👽 — Justme (talk) 18:40, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

We could start by making a dump site first. I kindly refer you to this Verge article which can explain what is suggested about. — Ron Merkle (talk) 23:03, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

Our first priority is getting the software properly setup, and functioning so we can edit and go public. That is #1 on the list, and then comes #2, the articles that we use to differentiate Justapedia from Wikipedia. — Justme (talk) 14:58, 7 January 2023 (UTC)

I see. Here's hoping that it's on a grand to-do list considering the recent big news about Saudi Arabia destroying history at Wikipedia. — Ron Merkle (talk) 02:23, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Wouldn't it be great if Justapedia can get its own server facility instead of having to rent office spaces and server farms? Unlike Wikimedia, Internet Archive has its own facilities instead and I'm fascinated by the server they've developed and using - PetaBox.

While it's tempting to set up facilities in big cities such as LA or NYC, I am not really receptive to the idea of putting all the eggs in a basket, especially the Pacific Coast in fear of the "Big One" earthquake. If Justapedia want to set up a redundant backup facility free from most disturbances in the foreseeable future, perhaps we can start with Texas and the Upper Midwest, particularly with the underground abandoned salt mines? — Ron Merkle (talk) 02:26, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

All ideas for the future to consider. We have already discussed the costs of maintaining our own servers, and a back-up system. We have excellent advanced techs on our team, and when the time is ripe, this will become an important consideration, but...first things first. We need to get bulk deletions and tools that editors can work with efficiently so we can get all the Wikipedia/Wikimedia Foundation references replaced, and our PAGs modified/revised to suit our mission, and then get launched. Categories and templates are complex and need editors with expertise who understand transclusion and the spider web it creates. We also have LUA issues that need to be fixed, so in summary, we need knowledgable editors to help with cleaning up the infrastructure, or there won't be anything much to save. — Justme (talk) 10:29, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

👍

👍👍 — JustaB (talk) 21:00, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

Doesn't seem to be any kind of community portal or discussion board. Also, when I look for links incoming to pages, I get nothing even where there clearly are other pages linked to the page. I'm sure this is all in the works, just making a note. — JustaB (talk) 21:52, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

JustaB, when you get a chance, read the Main page, Justapedia:Terms of Use, Justapedia:Justapedia Foundation, Justapedia:Board of Trustees, Justapedia:Editorial Review Board, and Justapedia:PAG for starters. We are currently working on some pretty major issues re: broken code, missing extensions, etc. We have a meeting at 9 am (AST) tomorrow, and hope to get some of the issues worked out. Once you settle in, get a good look around, and later on, I will include you in our meetings which take place on Whereby on Fridays, weekly now but will be making them bi-monthly or even monthly. Werkmeister has established a place to report issues at Pivotal Tracker, but I don't want to inundate you with everything right now. Enjoy a nice relaxing float in the shallow end of the pool, and once you feel comfortable navigating and have created a nice long list of all the things we need, then we'll push you off into the deep end. 😂 — Justme (talk) 22:09, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

🧐 — JustaB (talk) 22:19, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

You can start editing any article you feel like editing – you have an open door, and will be met with no resistance because we have not gone public, yet. The editors who have registered are working in their areas of interest, and are busy making articles neutral. It's like being in editor Heaven right now. — Justme (talk) 22:27, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

I'd more worried regarding those who try to replicate irrational deletionism from Wikipedia once Justapedia is launched. Someone who repeatedly scrambles puzzle boards during the game is generally hated by others.— Ron Merkle (talk) 04:04, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

JustaB, this is in the works. I'm in the middle of reducing WP's 70+ noticeboards and stuff like the Village pump to just 7 forums. The challenge is to remove any links or irrelevant meta pages that still link back to WP. — Aix (talk) 02:34, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

Don't forget the notorious SPI and LTA noticeboards artifact which does no good in the long run and may attract GDPR scrutiny in the long run. — Ron Merkle (talk) 04:04, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

SPI and LTA are gone, all 69,956 pages of them! — Werkmeister (talk) 08:17, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

AN, ANI, ArbCom and the infamous DS are gone too. Aix is building a new simple centre for help, discussion and reporting issues. Please see JP:Help and chat at the JP:Lounge. — Werkmeister (talk) 08:21, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

@JustaB: thanks for your remarks. The failing "What links here" is a known issue due to a really bad back-end script that is supposed to update the table of internal links but runs so slowly that it would take months to do its job. We plan to write a more efficient script to get this massive burden under control. Task tracked as PT #183824851. — Werkmeister (talk) 11:37, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

Werkmeister Thanks. Also thinking perhaps we can have some way of marking pages as having been looked at by a trusted editor. I did a quick random article check of five pages, Maloyaz, Republic of Bashkortostan, Sorbiers, Hautes-Alpes, Teddington Lock, Stapleton, Nebraska, Grace Adams. Aside from some Lua errors, they all look fine in the sense of not having any kind of political tilt pushed into them. With millions of pages we need to triage what needs urgent and real work. — JustaB (talk) 21:07, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

We'll need a bunch of articles which can demonstrate Justapedia's objectivity without accidentally tarring it with the alt-right or so. One of the palatable examples is FAI definition of human spaceflight, which documented the not-so-handsome nuances of Russian Vostok 1 space mission in detail, that Wikipedia chose to gloss/skim over as "fringe theories", despite being described as a historical-definitional issue by the closer of a long WP NPOV thread. Perhaps with the 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine, the readers would have less qualms to digest it after 60+ years of glossing it over out of the belief that space shouldn't be touched by politics per the overview effect. — Ron Merkle (talk) 00:22, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

I was just reading over some of the controversial topics on WP that roll on relentlessly, and breathed a big ole sigh of relief knowing JP is going to be remarkably different without the bullies! Sashi just went through days of groveling, and when asked on WO why he wants to subject himself to WP with all that baggage he said "Have you ever read Junkie ? Let me at the wixycontin... Bags? Where I'm going I don't need no stinkin' bags." Hopefully, Justapedia will salvage some of those poor editors from the pains of withdrawal if they'll just come on over...as much work as we have to do, it may even cure them. 😁 It's not that it's difficult work as much as it is time consuming. I felt 10 pounds come off my shoulders when I saw JustaB here editing. I've been writing policies, and truly appreciate that another trailblazer like JustaB is here riding drag. Hopefully, I'm not leaving too much crap behind. 🐄🐎🤠💩 Aix is doing an outstanding job with the design and organizing of the Forum & Help namespace. — Justme (talk) 01:06, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

The reason why the "bunch of articles" was brought up is so that we can capitalize these in front of the media upon Justapedia's launch without much fuss.— Ron Merkle (talk) 01:42, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

@Justme: I suspect there are more glossed-over controversies or nuances involving Russia such as Gagarin based on the extensive efforts they've gone to minimalize it. I'll see if Wikipedia's draftspace turns up something. — Ron Merkle (talk) 02:50, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

Fraud factories in Southeast Asia

They are copied from Wikipedia article "Fraud factory" and there are so many rooms of expansion, perhaps into something everyone can take a look at upon formal launch or even for Fixathon.

I think Chinese Wikipedia has intricate details on the topic and I'll try to smerge and translate these into the article.

In the meantime, can Justapedia set up an easy-to-use citation generator as seen in Wikipedia and start an automated bot that rescues links into the Internet Archive? Thank you so much in advance. — Ron Merkle (talk) 23:59, 17 January 2023 (UTC)

I use citer, and like it much better than what WP has offered in the past but you can make a suggestion at JP:The Exchange. Once Werkmeister gets back from the WEF event, he has a full schedule of bugs and features to work on. — Justme (talk) 11:09, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

@Justme:Finally! The citation function is present in the editing box which works like a charm! Regarding long-term plans I think I have to agree with you once that the space backup missions should be put lower down in the priority list, particularly when the leftover distortions from Wikipedia regarding Holocaust topics hasn't been resolved with professional expertises. I'll see if I can get a full list of articles that are potentially affected by the distortions so that they can summarily submitted to the Editorial Review Board.— Ron Merkle (talk) 23:59, 24 March 2023 (UTC)

It was met with apathy back on WO, but one of them was sympathetic enough to provide this on Wikipedia, which should translate to this or this right here.

Perfect opportunity

With all the fuss about Wikipedia's new reading interface, perhaps Justapedia can keep the 2010 interface as perrenial as possible and turn it into perfect opportunity to attract readers and possibly editors? You may want to make Justapedia into a read-only open beta (with registration still limited to some trusted/competent editors) given the moment. — Ron Merkle (talk) 22:15, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

5 min intro video

Just watched it which is quite great, however in future iterations of the video to make it more palatable, more examples of systemic bias against non-European perspectives (such as this that caused actual hacking actions) should be included. — Ron Merkle (talk) 03:55, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

TimedMediaHandler

Why did you remove the TimedText namespace reserved for the TimedMediaHandler extension? It is necessary to enable synchonized subtitles during audio and video playback. — Werkmeister (talk) 10:06, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

I just reverted my edit so you can see why I removed it from that template. It's a bracketed link that links to nothing. If you think it's necessary, then fix the link unless it suddenly becomes active when the extension is in use. — Justme (talk) 11:29, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

How to start a formal public case request for the Editorial Review Board

Good morning! I was wondering on how to start the first formal public case request for the Editorial Review Board. Obviously the case request will be all about distorted articles regarding the Holocaust in Poland, which was inevitably carried up to here when the fork from Wikipedia had been completed. — Ron Merkle (talk) 20:31, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

Ron Merkle, do you have a particular article in mind, and is it published on Justapedia? We getting closer to launching, but currently have a tech working out all the bugs. Point me to the article, and I will line up some experts from our ERB pool to review it. — Justme (talk) 11:27, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Unfortunately the distortions affected a large number of articles but from this paper, a graphic was shown with a list of some of the potentially affected articles.— Ron Merkle (talk) 16:11, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Here's a thought, Ron: on those articles, just use HotCat to add Category:Justapedia articles needing rewrites, and Category:Justapedia articles with content issues. How is that? Justme 💬 📧 18:45, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. I've just done that to the nine articles as mentioned by the infograph in Grabowski and Klein's article. — Ron Merkle (talk) 21:21, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

Lua errors

Here's just one example of possibly thousands: Colwall. Certainly there are plenty in all the articles I wrote for WP. The issues seem to be mainly concerned with infoboxes. The bold red alerts look ugly and do make Justapedia look like a half-finished project. — Aix (talk) 03:00, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

Abhi is not too far away from configuring Kartographer to use the maptiler account which should eliminate the Lua issues. He's got a couple of things he's working on right now and then will move to that short list of items. I will let Christian know so he can double check to make sure that issue is covered. Justme 💬 📧 03:09, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

ERB

As soon as the Editorial Review Board is set up during the launch, I'd want to file a formal request on fixing the Holocaust articles which was subjected to distortions back on Wikipedia. Any templates/baselines for that as a start? — Ron Merkle (talk) 03:54, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

Just fix them. The ERB is not for reviewing every article; rather, it is for reviewing articles for the main page and challenged articles. Justapedia is here to fix what is wrong with Wikipedia, so just fix it per our 5 fundamental principles. Justme 💬 📧 13:53, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

Unfortunately the distortion problem really need some deep expertise within the Holocaust to be fixed, which honestly I do not have. Indeed I didn't even edited Holocaust Wikipedia articles for once in my life so far after all. The only recourse would therefore a submission to the ERB (in this case composed of Holocaust experts from mainstream institutions such as ADL) and hope that they will be fixed, due to the possibility that distortionists will eventually cross over to Justapedia and expand/maintain their distortionist views if nothing is done about it. — Ron Merkle (talk) 18:00, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

That is not within the scope of this new ERB. Justme 💬 📧 23:20, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

I see. The only ways then would be asking TrangaBellam from Wikipedia (which according to Slate had attempted to fix the articles) or even Shira Klein herself to come here and get those done.— Ron Merkle (talk) 23:35, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

Absolutely - I tried inviting Shira but could not find an email addy for her. Good luck. Maybe they will wander over after we launch. Justme 💬 📧 01:38, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

This contains her professional e-mail address.— Ron Merkle (talk) 17:48, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

If you're prepared to spend 20 mins navigating to where it actually is. — Aix (talk) 06:33, 25 April 2023 (UTC)

I tried Shira again, and got the following message: "This website has been blocked from automatically composing an email." I imagine the trolls are after her. I PM'd TrangaBellam today. Justme 💬 📧 10:08, 25 April 2023 (UTC)

A suggestion

You asked me at Justapedia talk:Wikimedia sister projects to let you know in your user talk if I had suggestions about changes that I couldn't make myself, and I do have one suggestion about such a change. Would it be possible to get rid of the Justapedia:No Confederates and Justapedia:No racists essays? You deleted the Justapedia:No Nazis page in March, and the other two essays are very similar, and have been misused (at Wikipedia) in a similar way.

For example, last month the "No racists" essay was given as a reason for sanctioning the Wikipedia ex-admin Dbachmann, because of a comment he had made in 2018 expressing the view that human races should be considered separate subspecies. When discussing non-human species, the terms "race" and "subspecies" are used more or less interchangeably, so this isn't that unusual of a view to have. The meaning of the "No racists" essay, as it's currently applied, is that people can be sanctioned for expressing opinions such as that one. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 04:02, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Good find, Tetrapteryx - keep up the good work. Also, if you find Wikipedia where Justapedia is supposed to be, just fix it. Justapedia is not an advocacy - we are "just" a [encyclo]pedia. 😊 Justme 💬 📧 14:26, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Special:Statistics

Please see this page: Special:Statistics. There are links to various tools on Wikipedia in the Other Statistics, External Statistics section. We don't have access to those tools. Should I remove this text?-— Shahadat (talk) 04:35, 25 May 2023 (UTC) Page: Special:Statistics-— Shahadat (talk) 15:53, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

Shahadat, it depends on which tools - for example, when we go public, some of the tools that do not work now will work when we are not behind this safety net. We are working on getting Tool Forge working because we do qualify as a user of MediaWiki and we do support all of the projects sponsored by Wikimedia except for our differences of opinion about Wikipedia, and how it has been weaponized. Our position is not too unlike what Doc James has done by moving Project Med to a server of his choice. Back on topic: what & how many tools are there that are of no use to our editors? Let's discuss. Justme 💬 📧 18:51, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

Justme The page I gave you here (Special:Statistics) has links to these tools. Since they are not active here yet, should they be placed on this page now? tools 1, tools 2, tools 3, tools 4. -— Shahadat (talk) 18:53, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Shahadat, we need to bring those tools to the attention of Abhishek so he can adapt them for our use. I also want our user stats to be made active in the footer of our user contributions:

Justme: Subpages*User rights*Edit count*Edit summary search*Articles created*Global: contributions*log*accounts*(meta)

showing our accumulated number of edits, the number of articles a user has created, etc. ~~Also, please see the LUA errors on Del Bigtree - I sent Abhishek an email to fix those LUA issues but it appears he has been busy with other things.~~ I fixed the issue.

Christian is our CTO and a member of the Foundation Board of Directors - and he oversees the technical aspects of Justapedia but does not perform those tasks unless it is an emergency. Abhishek is contracted to handle the technical tasks at server level. Also, we are celebrating a holiday here in the US, so Christian will be unavailable until Tuesday, the start date for the setup of a dedicated server to handle our intensive maintenance operations. I will be available throughout. Justme 💬 📧 19:45, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

List of Wikipedia controversies

It's not really an ordinary meta artifact created during the forking of Wikipedia, rather it is a useful guide for readers who want to learn more about the controversies, like how List of controversies involving The New York Times is for NYT. — Ron Merkle (talk) 03:15, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Oh, ok - just don't want to be inundated with criticism of WP. It's not all bad. There are also a hefty lot of criticisms in Wikipedia. Maybe we can neutralize that page by merging some of those criticisms with the List? I can restore the page if we can get more balance, neutrality and objectivity in how we present WP. Justme 💬 📧 03:28, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Good idea. — Ron Merkle (talk) 03:29, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Knock yourself out editing!! *lol* Justme 💬 📧 03:31, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Not just the page, so many like Seigenthaler biography incident got accidentally removed as well. Here's badly hoping that critical mass of people from Wikipedia can defect and come over here to help, of course without bringing in the toxic nonsenses from there *lol* — Ron Merkle (talk) 02:26, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

That was a redirect that went nowhere. Not sure where the article is or why it would have been deleted, if it was even in our import. Please understand that we imported over 22 million pages with only 6.5+/- million articles in that number. The rest includes archives, ANI garbage, templates, essays, WikiProjects, etc. The work still left to do is unbelievable but we will get it done. Rome wasn't built in a day. I have deleted thousands of inactive WikiProjects, fixed templates, deleted ANI archives, etc. Our projects are simply called Projects. For example, see JP:Project Dogs - we are simplifying. Justme 💬 📧 02:39, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

I see. Not to mention that if Wikipedia goes the way of LoN and we become the UN of it, the process might have to be repeated again if it entails receiving the old contents of Wikipedia as posterity. The LoN/UN scenario in my opinion, is what will most likely happen to Wikipedia one day.— Ron Merkle (talk) 16:16, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

testing a graphic

The graphic we ~~will~~ might use on ERB reviewed files is so hope it also works as a topicon. Prolly not but we'll see. Justme 💬 📧 18:55, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

This is another graphic for reviewed work but not sure how small we can go. Justme 💬 📧 19:22, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

I have uploaded a few more including this one, and working on more. Shahadat is working on the topicon templates. Justme 💬 📧 02:43, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

Love it!!!

Justapedia:Noticeboards – Shahadat did an excellent job!! Check it out!! Justme 💬 📧 20:02, 16 June 2023 (UTC)

User scripts needed

Whackamole - did you get this? Take a screenshot of it. — Justme (talk) 16:56, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Genevian - well - I'm curious to know where you will be notified. — Justme (talk) 17:00, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Simplified version of the logo

I believe that if Justapedia wants to be a better version of Wikipedia, it will need a simplified version of the logo so that it will be easily recognizable as a brand. Sound logo is desirable too, which can be chose from superb but not winning entries of the Wikimedia sound logo contest.

Furthermore, are there any ideas of a possible launch dates at this point?— Ron Merkle (talk) 16:10, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

The brain logo looks awesome. Perhaps the next step is to start collaboration with other organizations which are in line with our goals, such as The Long Now Foundation, permanent.org, Internet Archive and more.— Ron Merkle (talk) 12:43, 18 July 2023 (EDT)

Agree. We need volunteers and good leaders who are willing and able to help lead the charge. Justapedia is on a grand mission to be the voice of neutrality and objectivity...of true knowledge. All Justapedists are welcome to pound the internet, knock on doors, spread the word, and recruit others who share our vision based on our five fundamental principles. Justapedia will always be a work in progress because knowledge is infinite. We are in a position right now to MAKE POSITIVE CHANGE!! We need donors to help further our mission, but I don't anticipate any of that happening prior to our launch at the end of the month. We can do what we've been doing - staying on course, fixing the errors we stumble upon, spreading the word, fixing-fixing-and more fixing of the many contentious articles we imported from WP that have received deserved criticism from so many different sources, and help show people the right way to create and edit encyclopedic articles. Far too many have lost sight of the reason why opinions are not facts, and why biased research is not objective research. I think it will make a big difference once editors realize the rewards that come with making an article worthy of inclusion in our main page Feature Showcase, such as being permanently locked to drive-by editing. Our readers will also better appreciate our mission to preserve true history, another major differentiation between many of Justapedia's articles vs Wikipedia's biased articles, the latter of which are attempts to change history. Justme 💬 📧 19:21, 18 July 2023 (EDT)

Indeed. Looking at how "sysopism" had made Wikipedia such a toxic place, the rules enforcement approaches certainly needed to be overhauled to humane methodologies such as reformative and preventative philosophies. The concept of "ban the behavior, not the person" is something worth to look at. Besides, to further avoid the traps of "sysopism" dead, stable and stale topics such as ancient Egyptian and Roman emperor articles might need to be locked from drive-by editing. — Ron Merkle (talk) 11:46, 19 July 2023 (EDT)

This video should serve as the latest inspiration to pursue and refine Justapedia's goals.— Ron Merkle (talk) 06:16, 20 August 2023 (EDT)

Inappropriate user page

Could you please delete this user page, and give that editor a warning and/or a block of a few days? I think we need to make it clear to the new members who are joining that despite Justapedia's anti-censorship stance, that doesn't mean we're going to tolerate throwing around ethnic and anti-gay slurs as is being done there. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 20:51, 17 August 2023 (EDT)

Thanks for doing that. If I were the one blocking him I'd have done it for a week, in case he's able to eventually reform himself, but I don't object to it being indef. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 23:49, 17 August 2023 (EDT)

Thank you for bringing it to our attention, Tetrapteryx. What hindsight has brought us after more than a decade of editing Wikipedia is that "nasty" is an undesirable characteristic inherent in some people, and we see no greater purpose or benefit to Justapedia by excusing such people for their nastiness. Allowing them to waste the valuable time of our volunteers by excusing their hurtful comments would be a failure on our part. Justapedia is not in the business of offering psychological or spiritual guidance, although we will act to help someone in an emergency situation. The JPF Board has long since determined that it is just not worth the effort to try and redeem the unredeemable. We choose to leave that in the hands of medical professionals. Justapedia is an encyclopedia, one of those "build it and they will come" projects, and we anticipate a steady stream of good editors registering over time. Are you familiar with Aesop's Fables? Justapedia is tortoise in The Tortoise & The Hare. Justme 💬 📧 10:15, 18 August 2023 (EDT)

I still believe that banning the behavior rather than the person is the way to go, out of the philosophy that every disruptors are theoretically redeemable and there's a nonzero chance that they're just a 14 year old edgy kids provoking people for no reason. That being said, if they pops up in another account and showed signs of redemption by making only good edits, then let them be. Otherwise they can be blocked for as long as the disruptive behavior goes.— Ron Merkle (talk) 21:56, 18 August 2023 (EDT)

These are not kids playing vandal, which is typically done by IP addresses from schools or bored kids at home. These are adults, and they registered purposely to cause us harm - probably WP editors who are angry over our existence, and are the same ones who attacked us early on which forced us to go into test mode. If it continues, we will start requiring IDs the same way most other public sites require, or at least some level of proof that they are here to build an encyclopedia. Keep in mind that we are an encyclopedia, not a day care center. Justme 💬 📧 22:02, 18 August 2023 (EDT)

It's better to get a GPT-powered anti vandal bot ready, just like ClueBot NG and those bots at Chinese Wikipedia which even can auto-block people who tripped their algorithms.— Ron Merkle (talk) 22:08, 18 August 2023 (EDT)

We're working on getting ClueBot NG installed. Justme 💬 📧 22:14, 18 August 2023 (EDT)

Getting logged out constantly

Hello, do you have this issue? What's the remedy? — B (talk) 06:19, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

Sincerest apologies, B. Yes, there are a few aggravating bugs we need to work out, and probably more in the software that we do not yet know exist. Another little annoyance at login is not being able to confirm or see the password we enter. These little bugs are coming to our attention now that we are live. They were not an issue when in test mode. Thank you for bringing it to my attention, and please do not hesitate to let me know of any other bugs you're experiencing. Justme 💬 📧 07:16, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

Ok, see if it's working correctly now. Paradigm made an adjustment, and it appears to be working now. It's an inherent flaw in MediaWiki. Justme 💬 📧 11:03, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

It's working better. — B (talk) 20:38, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

Justme 💬 📧 21:53, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

I can't edit a page, Cambodia, because it says "it contains a new external link to a site registered on Wikipedia's blacklist or Wikimedia's global blacklist". Possibly another bug? — B (talk) 04:50, 26 August 2023 (EDT)

Yep - thanks for finding it. What is the external link? Will try to get it fixed but if the site truly is blacklisted as an widespread internet issue, our blacklist will probably have it listed as well. Justme 💬 📧 08:32, 26 August 2023 (EDT)

Mediawiki actually provides a global blacklist of spam sites that we must avoid. You may need to find a better source. As for the bug, we need to update where the message points as far as Wikipedia. Mediawiki is actually the software we use. Justme 💬 📧 12:26, 26 August 2023 (EDT)

Some articles are pre-placed with forbidden links and it's kinda hard to find the links. Question, is there an option to move/change articles' names? — B (talk) 00:33, 6 September 2023 (EDT)

Hi, B - an administrator can move pages. What article, to what name, and what material are you needing to source with better sources than those that are blacklisted? Justme 💬 📧 14:24, 6 September 2023 (EDT)

This page, for example, and some other pages, some links are preventing editing. — B (talk) 03:40, 7 September 2023 (EDT)

B, email me the links that prevent editing on that page. Use (Tools - email this user) in the left margin. Justme 💬 📧 07:21, 7 September 2023 (EDT)

Can't find the email option on the left margin. Another article, Egypt, with a link preventing editing is - worldaffairsjournal.org -. — B (talk) 02:07, 8 September 2023 (EDT)

Do you have email enabled in your user preferences? Ok - I went to that link and it is an alternative link for an online slot game - PALACE303 - Situs Judi Online24jam Terpercaya which explains why it is on the spam blacklist. Anytime that happens, the site is an alternative link that is justifiably blacklisted. You need to find another Reliable Source, or search using the encyclosphere.org search to find a reliable source. Justme 💬 📧 18:55, 8 September 2023 (EDT)

Can users be given the ability to move pages since it's quicker and more convenient? I myself need to move some pages, consulting and waiting for an administrator to move pages would be slow and inconvenient. — B (talk) 23:29, 29 September 2023 (AST)

You can as a trusted editor. I will grant the permission. Justme 💬 📧 09:52, 30 September 2023 (AST)

Recommended settings and rules

Something I'd like to discuss about wikpedia. The problem with wikpedia is not its content but more about its governance and rules (especially the blocking policy, which are vague and open to power abuse). Here are some recommended settings that will differentiate this encyclopedia from wikpedia:

No account/user can be blocked more than 6 months. Account cannot be blocked for "sockpuppetry" as what is called on wikpedia (this policy is used as a punishment rather than a preventive measure; and user can only be blocked if they repeat the same violation). "Not here to build an encyclopedia" and "vandalism" are also vague policies that have been used to abuse users there. I think the only offend that can merit a block on an user is "warring edit" (says 10 reverts in a same article within a day), which will start from an hour, if repeated, a day, then a week, a month, so on, and maximum is 6 months, if the account repeat the offend after return, they can be blocked another 6 months. Rules regarding blocking has to be clear: if an account repeat a violation, how many hours or days will it get blocked again.

If these are not carried out, we are just repeating wikpedia's fallacy. — B (talk) 07:30, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

Just curious...why permit disruption? Justapedia is a free encyclopedia that anyone can edit but it is not a free-for-all for vandals to destroy. There is no happy middle; rather, it is one way or the other because of anonymity and how it emboldens people to do crazy things. JP is not a schoolyard playground where children are supervised, and learn how to get along well with others. They need to register with the latter ability or they will not get to stay. New editors tell us right away if they are team players or have their own agenda. Intentional disruption is damaging to the good of the order, and in an encyclopedic environment that equates into slowed progress. If you are paying hourly overhead from your personal financial account, I would think that you'd want productivity during those hours of operation, or you will not be in operation for very long. Justme 💬 📧 10:52, 22 August 2023 (EDT)

Even better, blocking based on activity and not by person. Besides there can be a mechanism for enforcing automatic retainment elections for every admin in the interval of every two years so to keep a check-and-balance on their power.— Ron Merkle (talk) 00:02, 23 August 2023 (EDT)

Proposed massive moves and updates of pages regarding the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

As our coverage of the war in Ukraine, particularly 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine still has the year 2022 on those which makes them too anachronistic in the respect that the war has extended past the year, massive moves and updates of pages regarding the war which will sync them a bit with Wikipedia is in order, although some native changes made here in the meantime (such as the expansion of information) will have to be retained. It's a gargantuan task that one alone might find pretty hard to accomplish.— Ron Merkle (talk) 11:24, 24 August 2023 (EDT)

We ask for your patience to allow our new tech to first fix our editing priorities, and then he will setup the systematic updates/imports. Remember, we are not Wikipedia, we are not in the business of up-to-the-minute news because so much of it is misinformation, and/or journalistic opinion. We are not a monthly magazine or daily tabloid - we are an encyclopedia, and our job is to make sure we are documenting TRUE HISTORY, not news headlines. It is not humanly possible at this point in time to make all of the controversial imported articles neutral and objective. You don't have to necessarily rewrite the entire articles; rather, you can simply add other significant views to add diversity citing RS keeping in mind that context matters, and tone down (neutralize) the opinions using proper wording, which is something ChatGPT can assist you in doing if you point it to the biased statements and request a more neutral approach. We are acquiring new editors and more will come over time to fix the biased articles. It is already happening. Thank you for all the work you're doing, but please have faith in our processes, and that everything will come together in time. Justme 💬 📧 11:47, 24 August 2023 (EDT)

Speaking about ChatGPT, it's been used to expand the lead of Cyber Anakin in a tiny magnitude just now.— Ron Merkle (talk) 00:00, 25 August 2023 (EDT)

Ron Merkle, can you activate mail? Justme 💬 📧 05:49, 25 August 2023 (EDT)

Why? Is it possible to use X instead for whatever you need now?— Ron Merkle (talk) 06:03, 25 August 2023 (EDT)

Justme 💬 📧 06:18, 25 August 2023 (EDT)

It has been expanded further.— Ron Merkle (talk) 07:06, 25 August 2023 (EDT)

Give it another sweep for grammar, spelling, citations, and nominate it again for the Feature Showcase. Justme 💬 📧 09:09, 25 August 2023 (EDT)

Promotional accounts

Could you please take a look at User:Davidpreston? This looks like an account that was created entirely to promote someone's business. I suggest at some point we should make a decision about whether those sorts of accounts allowed here. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 04:46, 12 September 2023 (AST)

Justme 💬 📧 12:50, 12 September 2023 (AST)

Fotbollströjor Nummer 50150 looks a lot like a promotional page too, although I can't tell for sure what that page is meant to be about.

A lot of the users creating these pages are presumably bots. Would it be possible to implement a better CAPTCHA for this site, in order to stop them from continuing to join? — Tetrapteryx (talk) 22:33, 25 September 2023 (AST)

Working on it - Justme 💬 📧 23:12, 25 September 2023 (AST)

While it isn't more spam, this edit looks like deliberate vandalism to me. Until it's reverted, maybe it's for the best that the images in that article aren't displaying properly. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 03:54, 7 October 2023 (AST)

It's only in the edit summary. As soon as I figure out how to oversight it, it will be removed. Justme 💬 📧 19:24, 7 October 2023 (AST)

The main problem was that they replaced the photograph of that person with a photograph of a penis. I've reverted it now, but I wish other people could be more observant about the spam and vandalism that happens on these articles. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 23:31, 7 October 2023 (AST)

User:Rslmanvan looks like more spam. Do you think the CAPTCHA can be improved at all? We're getting less of this now than we were before, but it seems we still haven't prevented bots from joining entirely. — Tetrapteryx (talk) 09:26, 11 October 2023 (AST)

It is ... but, there is actually some potential there for an educational article about moving if they play their cards right. I am probably wasting valuable time, but thought I'd give it a try this once, so I moved the User page to Draft:Rslmanvan and made a suggestion on their UTP. If it turns out they create a decent article, we can move it from Draft to a good title in namespace. There is another technical issue that we are dealing with to stop this botspamming. Justme 💬 📧 10:23, 11 October 2023 (AST)

We've got more spam again. [1] Should I continue to report this as it happens, or from now on will it be detected by the new extension you mentioned in my user talk? — Tetrapteryx (talk) 03:17, 14 October 2023 (AST)

As with most other online sites, humans are still needed. Thank you for your contributions and please continue. Justme 💬 📧 08:56, 14 October 2023 (AST)

Hi

Hello Atsme! It’s Illusion Flame from Wikipedia. This is a very impressive wiki you have. Look forward to contributing to it! If there’s anything you need help with or want me to do related to my normal areas of counter vandalism, NPP, anti-spam, etc, please do let me know!— Illusion Flame (talk) 06:36, 12 September 2023 (AST)

Also, could I be granted rights so I can edit the protected pages? I have some positive changes that I think can be made. Thanks! — Illusion Flame (talk) 11:56, 12 September 2023 (AST)

I recommend making suggestions on the TP of any PP you want to improve. We are keeping up with the edits of various users, and after you've been editing a bit and the dust has settled, we certainly will consider providing you with more tools. Settle in, learn about our mission and what we expect, and have fun!! Oh, and if you get a chance, watch this tutorial about neutrality and objectivity. In the meantime, we are still working out some of the kinks in our vandalism tools. I have been in contact with some of the WMF techs and explained our issues with WP's proprietary codes on some of our needed tools, and they are working with us. Isn't that wonderful?? Hopefully, we will soon have Xtools and Tool Forge operational. Right now, we are focusing on indexing and SEO. Justme 💬 📧 12:31, 12 September 2023 (AST)

That’s so cool! I’ll watch the tutorial now. — Illusion Flame (talk) 12:37, 12 September 2023 (AST)

In the future, when saying pages are a work in progress, you can use {{WQA in progress}}:

Work in progress; comments welcome

. — Illusion Flame (talk) 22:00, 12 September 2023 (AST)

Thank you for the suggestion, Illusion Flame. I gave the template a thorough review, and came to the conclusion that it doesn't fit our definition of a JP:Work In Progress, and it actually doesn't fit well with our PAGs for articles, either. I may end-up either deleting it, or converting it to better suit our purpose which only involves the wiki/Justapedia: namespace, not articles. Oh, and I will be granting you some additional user rights, starting with NPP reviewer since you've already been through NPP School, extended confirmed, and I'll see what else works well for now. Remember, we are still a relatively small community, and I'm happy to say we have attracted some excellent editors. Our community slogan should be Justapedia, the friendly community. 😄

Okay, understandable. Thanks! — Illusion Flame (talk) 20:36, 13 September 2023 (AST)

Breitbart News

Hello. I tried to edit the "Breitbart" page to remove some unencyclopedic content. However, I cannot edit the page, because apparently "breitbart.com" is on Justapedia's spam blacklist, and since the article contains the text "breitbart.com", it appears that the article cannot be modified. Can you please advise? — Philosopher (talk) 14:53, 12 September 2023 (AST)

Give me a bit of time to get back to office and see what’s going on. Justme 💬 📧 16:04, 12 September 2023 (AST)

Same issue on some other pages as well. — B (talk) 00:07, 13 September 2023 (AST)

Hi, B, please let me know what pages and we will look into it. That local blacklist was inadvertently imported from WP, and it contains more than just spam sites. They targeted sources that do not align with their systemic biases. We will remove those sources from that blacklist because Justapedia believes that context matters, and we have no intention of becoming a political weapon as what, sadly, WP has become. I also noticed some grammatical errors on the Breitbart News article that Factsfirst has been working on. The difference in the two leads is stark. Good job, folks! We are definitely on the right track in building a real encyclopedia!! Exciting! Justme 💬 📧 09:03, 13 September 2023 (AST)

Comment: B, breitbart.com is no longer on the spamlist. Please try to edit now. I hope you don't face the problem now. -— Shahadat (talk) 13:22, 4 October 2023 (AST)

Michael Gambon

While updating the Michael Gambon article to mention that he died, I was forced to remove the link to an article at Filmreference.com, because it is apparently on Justapedia's blacklist, even though that link had already been in the article before my edit. I'm not sure what to do about that, but I think you should be aware of it. — Deva (talk) 11:53, 3 October 2023 (AST)

It's probably MediaWiki's blacklist which comes with the software. I'll check it out because some of the sources on WP's blacklist will not be on ours, but most on MediaWiki's will be on ours. Justme 💬 📧 13:28, 3 October 2023 (AST)

There are a lot of other people who've died in the past year that Justapedia still describes as living people, but I can't update all of those articles myself. I hope someone else will eventually do that. — Deva (talk) 13:00, 4 October 2023 (AST)

Deva, if that happens to you again, let me know what the message reads. I went ahead and found another source because Filmreference is not a secure website. That may be part of the reason it is on a list. They were probably hacked by a spambot at one time, but I was unable to confirm that it was even on any of the spam or blacklists. We do not agree with WP's Perennial sources, or with some of the blacklisting they've done. We try to remove what we can from those lists but it is very time consuming, and we still have alot of behind-the-scenes work to finish so we depend on editors to bring it to our attention. Justme 💬 📧 21:17, 3 October 2023 (AST)

Fixed Deva, I've removed the Filmreference site from the spamlist. Please try to edit now. I hope you don't face the problem now.-— Shahadat (talk) 13:20, 4 October 2023 (AST)

Justme already replaced that source with a different one, but I'm glad the problem is fixed. As I said above, though, that was only one of dozens articles that need to be updated to reflect that their subjects are no longer alive. [2] — Deva (talk) 13:28, 4 October 2023 (AST)

Creating articles

How does one get permission to create articles here? I'd like to recreate an article that was deleted from Wikipedia. — Deva (talk) 19:21, 7 October 2023 (AST)

Have you tried Justapedia:Articles for creation? Justme 💬 📧 19:22, 7 October 2023 (AST)

I guess I could use that, but doing it that way creates a draft that has to be reviewed and approved by an administrator before it can go live. I was hoping to create the article directly, as has been done for all of the other recently created articles on Justapedia. Is there a way to get permission to do the latter? — Deva (talk) 19:32, 7 October 2023 (AST)

You haven't made enough edits for the program to consider you an autoconfirmed user. Right now, I'm having to deal with a new registration that thinks their lewd comment about a BLP is funny or something. Use AfC and let me know when you're done, and I'll approve it. In the interim, start logging some edits.

If it's just a matter of getting autoconfirmed, that should happen soon enough that I hopefully won't have to use AFC. Thanks for letting me know that that this permission is something users get automatically. — Deva (talk) 19:49, 7 October 2023 (AST)

Well, I now have over ten edits and have been registered for five days, so I should be autoconfirmed at this point, but I'm still not able to create new pages. So I tried using the article creation wizard as you suggested, but I also don't have permission to create drafts. Users apparently aren't getting the autoconfirmed status when they're supposed to, and for those who don't have it, using the article creation wizard isn't possible either. — Deva (talk) 20:05, 7 October 2023 (AST)

Justme 💬 📧 20:12, 7 October 2023 (AST)

My apologies - I meant extended confirmed. Just create it in your Sandbox, and I'll move it to mainspace. You are actually helping us by letting us know the issues you encounter. We have to be a bit more cautious because we do not have the manpower of WP, and we have already had "registered vandals". WP editors see us as a threat so they are doing whatever they can to make our lives miserable. The protections we are putting in place will protect your articles, too. Justme 💬 📧 20:19, 7 October 2023 (AST)

I just checked, and I apparently don't have permission to edit my own sandbox either. I'd suggest changing that, especially since this presumably affects all recently registered users, not just me. — Deva (talk) 20:26, 7 October 2023 (AST)

Ok, I just graduated you to a full-fledged editor. Let me know if you have any issues. Justme 💬 📧 20:38, 7 October 2023 (AST)

Thanks, but I still think this issue is worth addressing more generally. There's no good reason to deny new users the ability to edit their own sandboxes. Preventing that is likely to result in a lot of newbies making test edits in article space, when they might otherwise have made those edits in a sandbox instead. — Deva (talk) 20:45, 7 October 2023 (AST)

No worries, that is already on the list. Justme 💬 📧 20:47, 7 October 2023 (AST)